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Forum for those in general agreement with the ideas of Rosa Luxemburg.
Foro para aquellos que tienen un acuerdo general con las ideas de Rosa Luxemburgo.
Forum pour ceux qui ont un accord général avec les idées de Rosa Luxembourg.


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    five fingers make a fist



    Number of posts : 151
    Registration date : 2010-12-13

    five fingers make a fist

    Post  lost on Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:55 am

    today sees what will hopefully be a huge demonstration in london against the cuts and for an alternative.

    unfortunately i will not be able to attend for reasons i will not bore anyone reading with.except to say that references to the participation of the elderly,families and those with disabilities are hopefully more than passing wishes.whilst i do not doubt the event will try to be partipant and community friendly,my doubts lie in the lack of hard information about these issues having read numerous websites.even more seriously,is the unpredictable attitude of those who will line up against us-the police and others who think they lord it over us.

    but all the workers,students,young people and other participants will be in my thoughts and more.the best i can do is support those i know and write about it here and elsewhere.

    the prediction from the news media is that it will be as big as the early mass demonstrations against the illegal war against the iraqi people now almost a decade ago.between 100,000-200,000 are estimated.tuc/trade union congress advice seems to be that london comrades and contingents should arrive to ease the strain on participants and the management of the demonstfration.i hope we can take that advice as helpful and at face value-and not to help in its containment.

    i hope that numbers exceed qall hopes and expectations-a quarter of a million,half a million.for this is an occassion when five fingers make a fist.our numbers do not simplhy make us a crowd,an anonymous mass but they are just one sign of our strength,in which the total,whatever it is will be more than the sum of the is not just numbers,nor the union that makes us strong-though both are true.this is an opportunity for us to get aglimpse of ourselves sytanding up to our full height as individuals and as a class,to get an insight into our potential and our power,to begin to realise ourselves as a class and as fuller(er)human itself and indeed even with a lot more activity and change will not release us from our burdens as exploitedand oppressed people and class but it does open up the possibility.this is a moment when we can celebrate in beginning the fedstival of the oppressed.

    and we should remember those who we follow in time,and those in struggle across the addition,the world will not be restricted to those on the demonstration,for us,and those not,against;give a thought to those who for whatever reason cannot be there.some,indeed many will be keeping our neighbourhoods and communities going whilst others march.parents,carers,partners,spouses and others will have seen us off with breakfast,or something and will run our homes and care for our children or others in our temporary absence.or will host our ovefrnight stays,or drive us to the event,or will be servicing the event,some of them away from it,including the liberty lawyers,watching the police.

    i do not advocate violence but ido hope that we can demonstrate to those who rule over us,that in our celebration of our cause,our lives,ourselves we do not need them,their rules or their laws.society is not simply class divided and riddled with other divisons they use to exploit us,but they have also more specifically broken gtheir promises and their contract with us.alongside our clebration,our carfnival our hopes,they should knoiw and feel our word blade sharp rage,and power.they should tremble and drawer back.we should put their system to the metaphorical torch,raise in to the ground-slash and burn.we should take the pieces that are worth keeping and rebuild a better way,more suited to human needs,no longer based on profit and greed.

    against the cuts is a conservative demand,and for an alternative is rather vague.but i hope and suspect that defending the crumbs of society against cuts also propels us forward into realising we have deeper,legitimate needs and demands.and whilst they talk about their "mickey mouse"policies which they seem incapable of even thinking out properly,we who do the work anyway are perfectly capable of building something better ansd abolishing their crises.

    if marx is right that socialism might be based on"from each according to their labour,to each according to their need"-a working definition of socialism-then we should make those who provoked and lie behind the crisis pay for it.this has nothing to do with greed or class envy though it might be a step towards class building communism we can them move to a society which fully deals with human need-from each according to their abilty,to each according to their need.

    each journey,inclduing to a better world,starts with the first steps.forward march into a better future!



    Number of posts : 151
    Registration date : 2010-12-13

    keeeping sharp eyes and ears

    Post  lost on Sat Mar 26, 2011 8:58 am

    watching out for television,radio,and website news of todays anti cuts demoinstration,i make the following observations.

    one is the essential banal and conservative media who apply thgeir technologies in a very bland way.the talk stresses how "nice and respectable"it all is.radical medi could and would do better.indeed the needs of radical oppositional forces past and present forces them to be innovative.this innovation is not driven by the decadence of capitalism.

    two-there are references to thge black block of demonstrators.i could take aguess at who they might be and their motivation but id do not know.the media is prepared to make assumptions.

    three-i do however recognise some of the clothes and hoods and masks make a nonsense of police surfveillance.these demonstrators carry little and it is either instrumental-red and black banners,of anarcho syndicalism and libertarian communism-carried with pride rather than placards or minimal baggage close to the body to avoid arrest.his reminds me of advice given to,and demonstrators behaviour in the 1960s,1970s and 1980s.

    fourth-the media are quite eager as usual to pinb anarchist and swp labels to the black block.these are not accurate descriptions merely convenient sterotypes.i await the description thagt lawless anarchists justwant trouble and for the swp to be described qas rent-a-mob.its plain rubbish.

    in my experience in the past,the behaviour of both groupings may not match teh miserable expectations of the journalists of lies and rags but actually reflect a deal of discipline,self discipline.

    fifth-today that black block show a deal of self is at least possible to "see"police starting the scuffles.the black block hold back,though they will not be pushed around.they are perfectly entitled to chant "whose streets?our streets!".we walk these streets everyday going about our business.yet id do not doubt that many of those same young men alaos have plenty of experience of being stopped by those people disguised/hiding behind their dark blue uniforms becausre they are young,black,or for the way they dress or because they are carrying something suspicious.

    sixth-even if the black block simply lead the police "a merry dance"evading the police,or seeking out targets for occupation that some organisations have vowed to occupy,the tactic is functional.

    seventh-one of the groups who mighgt be planning the occupation of banks,seem to be young and if anything bright and casual in dress with bright posters.all are young,many probably students and appear to be led by young women-this is uk uncut,who are very sophisticated in their use of the new media and very media savvy that puts the media and police to shame.

    eighth-the police who are also "hidden"by blue uniforms and yellow high visibility it still the case that they sometimes-hide their id numbers?it is certainly the case that they use surveillance techniques,and they harrass and arrest the women photogrfaphers of the groups who have decided to apply the same tactics to the police addition over recent weeks there have been a string of stories about undercover police officers who infiltrate legitimate campagning organisations,spy on members and activities,and engage in sexual abuser and exploitation of some of those campaignetrs.they also engage in extremely personal and offensive descriptions of individuals that does not even have the justification of being related to what might pssibly be illegal activity.not only are these police agent provocateurs but they whine like they are sorry for themselves when caught out.they are never plain sorry for their reprehensible actions.

    ninth-the cuts that the community face are so deep and speedy that it is not possible to hide the real cuts on frontline police 2008 police themselves orgqanised amarch/demonstration in london against previous proposals about police were put forward.they were noteworthy in their isolation.i dont think many other than their own families supported them.

    it will be interesting to see what the police do in this context now.senoir officers themselves pointed out the likelihood of civil disorder as the rsult of slash and burn cuts policies.i am aware of at least one officer,locally signing the local anticuts petitions,about which i have posted seperately,some dqays ago.there are rumours about some police supoporting campaigns on a more collective scale.

    i genuinely wonder how the resisting community/working class should angry moments in the past,in our more irresponsible moments i remember overhearing banter conversatiosn about what would happen to disident police officers,given what they usually hand out to the community.yet they do pose a real problem.

    the police federation is not a trade union.i believe that the police were either striped of their trade union after strikes in 1919 in liverpoool or traded their unions for a relatively priveleged labour that compromise/compact has broken down i certainly think they will hqave to be sedn to unionise ansd to operate as "good comrades"befor they can expect any sectioin of the working class to believe or tqake them seriously,let alone support them.i think we would need to know wh9ose side they are on because drawing them intoclass unity is one think,importing an openly untrustworthy trojan horse given the story so far is something else.

    of course,i recognise the specific dynamics of a police force to a community willvary from society to the usa for example police officers are unionised in unions which reflect the features of other trade junions,which are themnselves the uk i suppose the federation is jmuch more like a staff association and a professional in egypt in recent weeks showed that all the resistance hated the police and internal security forces but more ambivalent to troops.even the ruling group recognised that they had to remove the police frtomm the equation.

    if the climate and temperature of class struggle heated up in the uk,especially when set in the context of an international dimesnion in which various parts of the world,if not on fire are showing the tensions in the system-i do wonder what would happen here and how these relations could or would play themselves out.



    Number of posts : 151
    Registration date : 2010-12-13

    the language is subtle but the politics are not

    Post  lost on Sat Mar 26, 2011 4:48 pm

    bbc news 24 is what is says it is,more or less:news and related themes 24 hours a day repeated and updated.yet even the repetition distorts.

    so what for example did become of the demonstrator the police were trying to arrest outside fortnum & masons,a plush store in was atsruggle for the police for he and his comrades had the sense to maintain their linked arms.

    one repoorter was clearly doing his job asa journalist,viewpoint aside in reporting this attempted arrest outside the occupation of the store by uk uncut to demonstrate that "we are not in this together",that the victims of the cuts do not have the resources of those who perpetrated the crisis,nor of the users of the extravagant items on sale at fortnum and masons or similar shops.

    another reporter seemed not to have the chance but appeared not to have the interest in accurate reporting so he reported that they(who?)told him that the black blocks(what awonderful expression,even if invented by the media),small groups of anarchists,the swp and uk uncut were all involved in skirmishes which included damaging property and petrol bombs,yet without evidennce of anything)and inevitably lumping evryone together and then marinalising them and distancing them from the peaceful tuc/trade union led demonstration earlier.

    i find none of this acceptable.its and old and tired story and trick that ive seen and heard through all my 40 plus years of activism.i am impressed that so many young activists,despite the apparent declines in activism during all too long periods of the last 50 or so years seem so savvy and will not fall into these old traps.i do have to agree with all the specific views,attitudes,politics,actions or tactics and detail to appreciate that they do however have legitimate poiints of view largely with their own logic,which are certainly defensible in principle and indeed before the law should they be arrested and put to the test.

    if i were put against a metaphorical wall or even a real one and given the choice between thes young comrades and the so called respectable forces of law and order and the state,i would have to side with these comrades.i do not for example have to be an anarchist to have respect for their positions,their courage and their intelligence.

    the give away was the juxtaposition of news reportage of the yemen and libya where people are standing up for a voice,their rights,against rising food prices,unemployment present given the imperialist intervention in libya dn the region it does not serve the interests of those states or their media stooges to comment on the destruction of property.yet the young activist in london fighting against cuts and the abolition of jobs and services are already cast as breed apart.

    i make no apology that our class and our movements will be peopled by many different shades of opinion and attitude.some of them may make us uncomfortable but we should not allow the ruling class or its lackeys to cast apsersions,to caste some of ours aside and to divide us.

    there is not a deserving and undeserving poor or working class.there is a single class and its allies,which must resolve its own difficulties and seek maximum unity in action to actively construct a better way,a better world with means which are as inclusive as possible and which project us from thsi intolerabel hell to something better.

    just asd we make all the wealth of this social order,so are we capable of hammering out the alternative through our labour,experience and intelligence.


    Number of posts : 341
    Group : Réseau Luxemburgiste International/International Luxemburgit Network
    Website :
    Registration date : 2008-04-16

    Re: five fingers make a fist

    Post  ElIndio on Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:41 pm

    I saw a brief news report here in France where it was said that 250 000 demonstrators stood up against the cuts. This is great news and it is in line with the recent student struggle there. In spite of losses, I think that it is a sign of class consciousness that is starting to emerge and definitively what the Arab workers are doing will do more than shake their local despots.

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    Re: five fingers make a fist

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